Witchcraft, Herbal Magic, and Personal Empowerment with Coby Michael

This week's episode features the captivating Coby Michael, a profound author, occult herbalist, and magical practitioner. He unfurls the petals of herbal magic, revealing how rebellion and survival have woven into his identity as a witch. We delve into the transgressive essence witchcraft has that calls to many seekers.

Our discussion traverses the path of shadow work, where embracing your darker half isn't just healing—it's empowering. Coby shares strategies for shaking off self-doubt, from adopting a 'fake it till you make it' mentality to the warmth found in our community of fellow practitioners. As we talk, the importance of maintaining individual energetic boundaries emerges as a key to personal growth within the craft.

Wrapping up, we reflect on the humility and open-mindedness that the diverse witchcraft community teaches us. The episode is peppered with anticipation for the projects he has brewing—like his upcoming poison path book and a flying ointment class, and the much-anticipated Botanica Obscura conference. Listen in for a blend of practical spell work wisdom, Coby's insights into dark herbalism, and even a personal recommendation for those of you who enjoy incense.  Join the conversation and enrich your magical journey with us on Your Average Witch.

Learn more about Coby here: The Poisoner's Apothecary 


Check out this week's sponsor, The Cozy Lotus Soul! 

Transcript

Kim: 0:04

Welcome back to your Average Witch, where every Tuesday, we talk about witch life, witch stories and sometimes a little witchcraft. This episode of your Average Witch is brought to you by the cozy lotus soul. In this episode, I'm talking to Coby Michael, author, occult herbalist and magical practitioner. We talked about herbalism, what it means to be a witch, and sobriety. Before we get started, let me tell you about our sponsor, The Cozy Lotus Soul. Are you ready to add a touch of magic and coziness to your wardrobe?

Kim: 0:40

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Coby: 1:45

Hello, thank you so much for having me.

Kim: 1:48

Thank you for being here. Would you please introduce yourself and let everybody know who you are and what you do and where they can find you.

Coby: 1:56

My name is Coby Michael. I am author of the Poison Path Herbal and owner of the Poisoner's Apothecary. You can find me on social media at poisonersapothecary and on my website, thepoisonersapothecarycom.

Kim: 2:18

What does it mean to you when you call yourself a witch? If you do?

Coby: 2:28

I do and I have, since my early teenage years, identified with the archetype of the witch.

Coby: 2:38

You know, magical practice is something that can be found throughout history, all over the world. But to me being a witch is a little bit different than being a magical practitioner or a folk magician or a spiritual person that employs magical practices. You know, to me there is a little bit of a transgressive sort of rebelliousness that comes along with being a witch and sort of embracing some of the you know maybe more sinister associations that have been applied to that word over the years. So for me it's about rebellion, it's about self-empowerment, it's about survival, All of those things kind of wrapped up into one and just really, you know, identifying this powerful figure that is not afraid to not only work with the forces of nature and the spirit world but also to, in a way, kind of stand in their own power and sort of embody a force of nature in and of themselves and really kind of demand to the universe and the spirit world the way that we would like to see things happen.

Kim: 4:05

It's my favorite when people come on and match my problem with authority. I just that's one of my favorite things about us. As I don't know creatures, whatever you want to call us, I love it. Don't tell me what to do, yeah yeah, but if you are. I'm going to fight you, so get ready.

Coby: 4:30

Exactly.

Kim: 4:33

Would you say that you have any family history with witchcraft or magical practice?

Coby: 4:41

It was more so. You know, I was growing up in the 90s and there was a lot of, I think, paranoia with like the satanic panic and the different like I don't know if it was Jim Jones or Heaven's Gate, I think maybe like all of the above, all of like the cult stuff going on, and it was, I think, just something that was really, you know, kind of popularized in the media at the time too, but it always seemed to be like more from a perspective of fear. I guess. Anytime that the topic would come up, whether it was like a horror movie that I wanted to watch or a book that I wanted to read or something spooky that I was interested in, I would kind of get this initial fear reaction from a lot of the people around me, and I think that, more so than anything kind of drew me in more.

Coby: 5:42

You know, if somebody tells me not to do something or that something is off limits, you know there's a reason why, and so I want to dig deeper and really get to the truth of it. I did find out a little bit later in life that one of my great, great, great aunts was a powwow practitioner, and my grandmother just has like some different memories of her doing like different healing prayers and things like that when they were to injure themselves and like a little bit of, I guess, like apotropaic folk magic from my grandfather talking about like I think they would wear either like garlic or onion or something in a little bag around their neck to protect them from getting sick. So that's pretty much the scant memories and material that I have like just going back through my family.

Kim: 6:43

That is so neat. I grew up on the very border of Appalachia. Like if you look at the official if they exist maps of where Appalachia is, I'm just a hair out of it. But I mean my immediate family. But I have other family who actually did live in it. So nobody in my family did it was it's just. I like hearing about that from other people because it's not something I got to experience.

Coby: 7:18

Yeah, I didn't really think it was was part of my upbringing either until like probably my mid 20s when, just like a few, you know, I'd ask people about things and wouldn't get anything. And then just all of a sudden, you know my grandma's like oh yeah, aunt Catherine, she practiced pow, wow, and you know she would like sing these little songs or do these little chants and like hold her hands over like the area that was injured and make the pain go away, and it's just like, oh, you know, this is what I've kind of been looking for.

Kim: 7:50

But I will admit to having some envy about that. Can you introduce us to your practice Like on an average day? How does your practice, how is it part of your life? I?

Coby: 8:09

think that it is. You know it's just such a part of my, my worldview and just how I'm like wired into this existence with everybody else that I guess you know what other people might think is like part of my practice is just something that I do unconsciously. You know very sensitive to energy, other people's energy, lots of smoke cleansing and different things like that, and you know working with with plant medicine on occasion and in different ceremonies, kind of through for my own healing process, my own spiritual growth and then to kind of help other people. So since I I started doing this more publicly or professionally, a lot of it comes through in teaching and facilitating and kind of holding space for other people doing divination, giving people advice on how to connect with plant spirits, how to kind of get into what the poison path actually is and start kind of delving into that area of magical practice.

Kim: 9:36

What kind of divination do you do?

Coby: 9:39

I do a little bit of everything. So I kind of use different divinatory modalities to tap into being able to channel information. So I do read tarot I don't consider myself a professional tarot reader and I also read the runes and that kind of. I'll normally do both because I feel like different but complementary information comes through with both of them combined. And you know, if there's something that the runes aren't necessarily communicating, it normally gets communicated in with the tarot or it gives a little bit more clarity and insight into kind of what one or the other is talking about. And then once I kind of tap into what that conversation is, then I'm able to just sort of open up and start spewing things out that kind of come from sort of nowhere but they seem to be applicable.

Kim: 10:45

I'm starting to get into using tarot more. My friends and I are getting more into what I'm interested in. It's not something that was really part of my practice, but I'm trying to bring it in.

Coby: 11:03

Yeah, I was always more interested in studying the tarot and kind of reading different people's interpretations of like picking apart all of the different symbols and figures and different colors that pop up in the cards and then getting into like the Hebrew letters and numerology and things like that, and so I was always sort of more of an armchair tarot person. But I guess enough of it kind of stuck that you're able to pick up on a lot of those visual cues that show up in the cards and then kind of tap into sort of your own personal associations and it just it really seems to work and I think that the traditional Rider Waite Smith tarot imagery is, you know, it's just really able to communicate, I think, better than a lot of, you know, maybe like Oracle decks or decks illustrated by other artists because of all of the symbolism from the Western esoteric tradition.

Kim: 12:11

Yeah, I like the look of my favorite deck to look at is either Marigold or oh no, I can't remember his name the guy with the hyenas, Koss? I don't remember. Anyway, those are my two, but I don't. There's not enough symbol symbology on there for me. So I am learning what the writer. After buying many a deck, I've returned to the Rider Waite to actually learn how to do it.

Coby: 12:47

Yeah, I think there's something to that. You know, you get all of these really beautiful different artistic interpretations of the cards, meanings that other artists have put forward. But I think, as like a learning Rider Waite Smith, the deck is the one that really kind of sets the foundation so that you're able to read from these other decks without just like memorizing the definition.

Kim: 13:12

Yes, yeah, would you say. Witchcraft has changed your life.

Coby: 13:19

I would say so. I would say that it has been one of the major shaping forces in my life. It's kind of been, you know, the one constant thing since, you know, really early childhood that kind of drove me forward and kept me going and was really just this, this pull of a passion for this stuff that I've had since a really young age, like a weirdly kind of young age, I think, for somebody to really graft onto, you know such a big enigmatic kind of a theme. You know, I know a lot of us were exposed to like hocus, pocus and the craft and different movies and things like that. But even before any of those things existed for whatever reason, I just really thought witches were cool, you know, in like little children's books, and always loved the witchy villain and it's always been such a definitive part of who I am and how I interact with the world.

Coby: 14:34

You know that it's just kind of been the major driving force in my life and then going through, you know, different different traumatic experiences and periods of growth and adolescence and just kind of like all the different difficulties that a person can go through in life, that was something that I always fell back on, and even when it wasn't, you know, necessarily witchcraft by definition, because there were some times that I I shirked away from the, the idea of the witch a little bit and went into more of like a pagan nature based spiritual perspective, that that connection with nature and connection to not only the physical environment but the, the spirits and the energies present, was something that I would always kind of go back to when there was not really anything else to hold on to for, for hope or support or healing.

Kim: 15:42

I think it's really interesting. Maybe it's happened before or it happens in waves or whatever, but I think it's neat that people in the witch community seem to be leaving the term pagan and coming outright. I am not a pagan, I'm not. I'm giving up that term. Please don't apply that to me. I think that's so interesting because I've never thought about it until. I think temperance said something about it and it's just interesting to me.

Coby: 16:18

It is interesting and I think that you know it's an important distinction for a lot of people and they're not necessarily one in the same.

Kim: 16:27

Yeah, that never. It never occurred to me until I really thought about oh OK, that does make sense, why it needs to make sense to me. Who knows what would you say is the biggest motivator in your practice and would you say it's changed since you first started out?

Coby: 16:51

Oh, the biggest motivator has probably been, you know, initially gaining a sense of safety and control. When you know various different external factors were making me feel not safe and not in control, oops, and it that kind of evolved into more reclaiming of personal power and sovereignty and self identity. And then, once you know I started kind of getting that back, then it then it turned into more of a, you know, taking that empowerment and growth and sort of turning it against these different forces that had in my past kind of held me down and it sort of became about for lack of the better word revenge and, you know, bringing suffering upon all those who had wronged me in the past. And I think that that's just part of the healing process. It's not a bad thing. It doesn't make you a bad witch. If anything, it makes you a really, really excellent one.

Coby: 18:21

So, being able to have an outlet and, you know, express all of those nastier emotions and really let your own personal shadow kind of flow through you and, you know, wreak havoc for a little while and get all of those nasty things out and be heard and feel like it's, you know, really being seen and not just this approach of, okay, I'm gonna sit with my shadow and the different aspects of myself that I don't like and then I'm going to try and disassociate with them so much that they just kind of vanish and disappear and go deep, deep, deep into the unconscious. I think kind of tapping into that wicked witch archetype and idea is a really cathartic experience for a lot of people and in many cases necessary, you know. So really it's about. It's about personal empowerment, just claiming from the universe what is yours.

Kim: 19:26

I feel like having that as a choice, as an option. Knowing that you have that option, you can decide not to use it, but it makes you feel safer. Just okay, there's something I can use if I need to. I don't have to, so I have the piece to be able to figure another option if I need to. That's how it is for me anyway, just knowing I have something in my back pocket Like I've never smoked. But people who hang on to one last cigarette after they quit, that's what it reminds me of.

Coby: 20:01

Yeah, witchcraft is the last cigarette.

Kim: 20:07

What would you say is your biggest struggle when it comes to witchcraft?

Coby: 20:13

Hmm, that's a really good question. What is my biggest struggle? It's I don't know. I think a lot of times it just comes from a place of insecurity and almost like imposter syndrome or maybe feeling like the type of witchcraft that I'm practicing or what I'm putting out there into the world is not necessarily like what other people need or what is, you know, sort of the status quo in the wider magical community and sort of trying to walk this dualistic path of light and dark. It's really kind of a struggle, I guess, more in how those two things are being embodied and sort of transmitted through me.

Coby: 21:19

So sometimes working too much in the shadow kind of has these detrimental effects of just like making you feel not great, not great about yourself, not great about the world. You know, connecting to a lot of like lower vibration energies and thought forms and things like that, you know, for a greater purpose, but at the same time you can't walk solely in that because then it starts to kind of influence who you are and who you project yourself as a person. So it's important to be able to come back to the other side and, you know, work with more light, healing practices, balancing things, really doing like a lot of personal introspection and healing work and separating, like, what energies are actually yours, what energies are other people's and, you know, still being able to kind of keep the orientation, for you know the path and direction that you're headed on. So I guess balance would be the short answer.

Kim: 22:35

I feel like I need to work on that. You mentioned imposter syndrome. How do you beat it?

Coby: 22:46

Well, you just fake it till.

Coby: 22:49

you make it, you really do you know, I think that kind of act in this role that a lot of times can be difficult to identify with, you know, compared to what's going on in your own internal dialogue. But you just keep doing it and then that becomes more solid and concrete and it gets reflected back through other people. You know kind of how they see you and the work that you're doing and you know, eventually it's just like taking another step up the ladder and you become like a little bit more comfortable in this new role or this new perspective, and then you start to doubt that. And then you get a little bit more comfortable and move up, and then you start to doubt that. And so it's just this constict, kind of like self glamour, of like convincing yourself that you are all that's a good one, holy crap.

Kim: 24:01

Yes, what brings you the most joy in your practice?

Coby: 24:09

When I can connect with other practitioners that really identify with the type of work that I'm doing and kind of the current of energy or current of witchcraft that runs through me and that work, because I think that a lot of people, you know whether they've taken my classes or followed me on social media or like heard me speak before on a podcast or whatever some people get little bits and pieces of it and that's great and they can take from that, you know, whatever they need to enrich their own practices. But then there's other people that just really kind of tap in and you sort of see, like that that aha moment of like okay, like this is this, is it Like he's speaking my language? This just resonates on so many different levels and that's really really rewarding when I can feel that connection with other people.

Kim: 25:19

I like that too. I don't see very many people, but those that I do see, I like it Once in a while. I'll like I'll get an email thanking me for this. What is something you did early on in your practice that you don't do anymore, and why don't you do it?

Coby: 25:43

I don't know if there was anything that I really did on a regular enough basis that I don't do anymore. I think maybe. So when I really started out like studying and researching and being in my practice and that kind of like taking its form, I was really not that interested in the Wheel of the Year. I didn't care about like all of the eight holidays and their weird history and all of the contradicting information and just that sort of whole conversation about like what these holidays were, where they came from and how they now have a place in modern witchcraft. So I kind of started to, I guess, come up with my own, which was a little bit more based on like astrology, you know, still observing like the solstices and equinoxes. So I don't really have like a set Wheel of the Year anymore.

Coby: 26:56

I think every year is a little bit different and you know, one year might be more about, like, salwin and Lunasa, the next year might be more about the autumnal equinox and Ostara and I don't. You know, I don't even use those names to talk about them. But yeah, I don't know, I've kind of just sort of grown away from that eight-spoked Wheel of the Year and kind of have like my own observances. You know certain dates and times that have accrued meaning just through personal experience, and I guess that and you said you're in Florida.

Coby: 27:46

Yeah.

Kim: 27:48

Especially there, I would think, because the seasons don't hit the same.

Coby: 27:55

No, they really don't, and that was. That was a really difficult transition for me too, coming from the north, where you have all four seasons and you can really feel the movement of all of that, and then also like being a plant-based practitioner or a green witch, you know you're really working within like the agricultural cycles, and then you come down here and all of that just kind of gets ripped away from you.

Kim: 28:25

It's always harvest season.

Coby: 28:27

Yeah, it is, and there are seasons here, but they're not the four seasons, they're not the seasons that I know.

Kim: 28:36

Yeah, I relate. What would you say is your favorite tool? Not necessarily a physical thing, it can be like an idea or a philosophy and how do you use it?

Coby: 28:51

I would say my favorite tool is fire, and we can take that into like a more esoteric thought and say that it is willpower, the magical will, and that goes back to kind of fake it until you make it and you're just kind of this opposing force in the universe that establishes their will and grabs on to this direction that you feel yourself heading in and you kind of just keep pushing and pushing and pushing against all things that would oppose that and I think, if you push long enough, that it carves a more permanent groove in the wheel of the universe and things start to reflect that.

Coby: 29:54

Your life starts to change around you, the spirits start to listen. I think they put a lot of like blockages and hurdles to overcome in our path. And if you can show that your will is just unshakable and that you are not going to let anything stop you or stand in your way and that you would rather die than see anything other than your will, manifest that, that starts to draw a lot of attention and eventually energy starts to kind of flow in the way that you want it to you and you know, almost start kind of manifesting things just by thought, by working towards them. You know. So while while ritual practices is very important and you know I still do spell work and things like that is generally more for like devotional offerings or healing or protection it's not typically to to get something or to cause some kind of desired effect. Other than that, I think that you can eventually kind of tap into that energy force and things just start to happen because you will them to.

Kim: 31:15

I like that analogy A lot. Can you pick out one decision you've made that changed the course of your life?

Coby: 31:35

I've been a lot of decisions I guess that I've made that have changed the course of my life. I think the probably the biggest one and it's kind of two different things wrapped up into one was it was right around the time that I finished putting together like the first manuscript copy for the poison path herbal and was really trying or really starting to settle into the idea of doing what I'm doing now as my career and sort of main profession. So the first thing that I did was filed for divorce. That was probably one of the best decisions that I ever made because that situation was holding me back in a lot of ways. And throughout the entirety of that relationship I was also on methadone, doing methadone maintenance for opioid addiction.

Coby: 32:47

That went on like late teenage years to early 20s, and so I was on methadone for about seven years I think. So it was almost coincided like at the exact same time where I filed for divorce and then within like I think like a month or two, I had gotten to a point where I weaned myself down to a point where I could do like a safe detox from methadone. So I got off of that and it was kind of, you know, writing and wanting to travel and just really wanting to like step into this new, this new role or this new life. I knew that that wasn't going to be possible in my current situation, so those two things were probably the biggest kind of turning points, I would say.

Kim: 33:43

Maybe about my divorce. I think that maybe that, combined with joining in the army, helped me also decided divorce, so I don't know which one would count as the decision. I think I know the answer to this question based on your previous one, but how do you pull yourself out of a magical slump, or do you feel like you get in those?

Coby: 34:25

Yeah, I think it's been kind of a fluctuation. You know throughout my life that sometimes you know, life gets in the way, or you know, maybe you're just feeling like depressed or not great or less than magical, or sometimes the the magical side of life kind of loses some of its wonder and you can just sort of find yourself in this like despondent place where it's just gross. How do you pull yourself out of that? I don't know if you do pull yourself out of that. I think it's just kind of a natural part of the cycle of working with, with this type of energy, these types of spirits.

Coby: 35:18

I think that you know, sometimes the, the energy just doesn't flow or it needs to rest or it needs time to gestate. So just kind of sitting in those feelings and, you know, doing things that are mundane and being okay with it. You know we don't always have to be these wand-wielding magical superheroes. You know, sometimes we can just be, be human, and that's okay too. But I think that that reading and writing is probably like the main way that I can recharge my magical batteries. You know, if I find something that is super interesting or a topic that I've been wanting to read about or delve into for a long time and kind of catch that like obsessive part of my brain that just wants to latch on to that thing. That's helpful.

Kim: 36:20

Nobody's ever said that in that way before. I say I don't generally, I just wait to come out, but I like the way you phrased it better. What's something you wish was discussed more in the witch community?

Coby: 36:42

I would like to see, I think, more people talking about addiction and recovery and their own personal experiences, whether it has, you know, directly affected their lives or indirectly affected their lives, you know, and it doesn't just have to be about, you know, substance dependency or substance abuse or whatever you want to call it, but just really people like being more open about their trauma or the things that they've overcome.

Coby: 37:27

Or we kind of have like this rose-colored view of all of the you know, big-name pagans or super successful, like witchy people on social media or that do this professionally and they just seem to have it all together.

Coby: 37:45

It's like great understanding of spirituality and magical practice. And I think that that what people need to see is more of the gritty, visceral side of it and, you know, get more more real people. You know not to say that that's the case with everybody, but it's just kind of how it gets presented and you know it's not always fun or nice or comfortable to talk about or be open about those things. You know it's much more enjoyable to like share the different books that you're reading or share pictures of your, your witchy cupboard or your altar table, but in a way we're kind of like perpetuating this, this hyper idealistic perception of what it is to be a witch, what it is to be human, and you know, I think that that causes a lot of difficulty for people that don't necessarily see that in their own lives and then cause them to question, you know, like, what's wrong with me, what am I doing wrong, you know?

Coby: 38:58

so, I think just being more more open and sharing more about those things, so that other people that are maybe in that same place can be made to feel like they're supported or that they're not, that there's not something wrong with them when you said it, I found it terrifying you know, I think a lot of us have been through some really difficult and uncomfortable situations and had some really do you know, horrifying life experiences, and I just think that if we were more comfortable with showing that side of ourselves, that that would benefit the, the wider community, a lot more than you know. Here's my latest book of spells. Go to my website and buy my stuff on on my website.

Kim: 40:00

I don't want to. How do you think we should broach that? Because I'm the child of an addict and I'm an addict myself. But I don't know how to talk about that. I don't know how to bring that up or say I don't know how to introduce conversation about that or facilitate or anything I have no idea, because it's scary to talk about yeah, it is, you know it.

Coby: 40:34

Just it seems to come up a lot for me, especially over the past couple of years, just kind of like going through this interview process. You know we get asked questions about. You know what's your origin story, what influences your practice. You know what are different difficulties that you've had and I think that you know for a lot of people the the easiest answer is is just whatever sounds, you know, the witchiest or the most cliche.

Coby: 41:04

But when we really really dig into why we are the way that we are and we connect to the things that we connect to you, you know there's a lot of of really heavy, really deep stuff that that goes into that. You know we're not, we're not the status quo, we're not like everybody else. The way that we perceive the world is not like most people do and there's like a really big reason for that and I think in a lot of cases it's sort of in that process of trauma and self-destruction and rediscovery that is partly why the next question I had to rephrase it because I was trying to acknowledge that your three biggest influences on your practice not necessarily people.

Kim: 41:59

It can be philosophies or ideas, or it can be Christianity, because it shows us how maybe we shouldn't be, or it scarred us as children and we moved into witchcraft because that made us feel like we had some power of our own. What are your three biggest influences and what would you thank them for?

Coby: 42:26

well, christianity is one of them, you know, and I think that that's why I identify with this more. You know air quotes, traditional witchcraft, archetype of you know it, not necessarily being all about, you know, love and light and and crystals and flowers and things like that, but but really like holding on to you and honoring and recognizing that there is this darker current, that that runs through what we do, you know, and not necessarily dark, meaning bad, but just going all the way back to the beginning, the garden where we've got this, this otherworldly serpentine transmitter of forbidden knowledge, and the willingness to be transgressive and go against the law of God and take that knowledge into ourselves. You know, that's been probably one of the the biggest shaping forces of my witchcraft and how I identify.

Coby: 43:44

It's almost like we're we're Christians but we're just really bad at it, you know I don't know if you ever ever escape the narrative, and not in this country you know, you're still kind of part of that, that narrative that's been shaping everything for for such a long time.

Kim: 44:11

I hate that.

Coby: 44:12

I hate that you know, I'd rather be standing on this side than the other side so.

Coby: 44:24

I think that kind of Christian paradigm good and evil, dark light, god and the devil, nature versus society you know all of that has been super, extremely influential. The next thing, you know I would I would say just my, my journey with recovery has been super influential, or maybe like one of the more meaningful influences, you know, just trying to get yourself together, get your life together and, you know, reaching for anything that's going to to help you do that. You know it's, it's been such a huge part of my own personal story that you know to say that it hasn't influenced my spirituality, you know, would probably not be true. And the third thing is just the natural world connection to nature, specifically to the, the spiritual side of nature, the hidden side sorry do you have any advice for anybody just starting out calling themselves witch, taking on that identity?

Coby: 46:01

I guess you have to, you know, kind of ask yourself what is it about the identity of the witch that is making you want to put that label on yourself, because I think that there are a lot of different reasons that people would have to kind of put on that mantle. You know, because it is. It is so wrapped up in so many different you know societal roles and and just who we are as humans, that it's a very, very kind of loaded word and it means a lot of different things to you, a lot of different people. So I think that you can find a lot of, you know, sort of insight into who you are and where you're at. You know at the current time, by how you, how you define that, and you know what it means for you as a human being and magical practitioner.

Coby: 47:18

My other advice would just be don't be a dick. Don't act like you have all of the answers. Don't question what other people are doing, you know, I mean there's there's one thing to just put out incorrect information, but it's another thing to have a different way of doing things. And then you know all of these little voices online that want to, you know, make themselves feel like they're the expert or that they're more proficient, because, well, that's not the way that you do it, or that's not the way that I was taught to do it, like that's just the most gross and demeaning, and like it just makes people very, very, very small what a good answer.

Kim: 48:12

That was exciting to experience. I know my face was expressing so. After you've heard these questions and the ones to come, who would you like to hear answer these questions? Who should I invite on the show?

Coby: 48:34

Oh gosh. Hmm, I might have to think about that for a minute. Who, who, who, who, who I? Oh, it has to be Oralis, oralis Flores, the mystic Um show. Lipstick Mystic is her Instagram handle and she runs the Moon and the Muse. I think that Oralis would have some really interesting and important perspectives on this topic. Um, you know, because, just like I was saying, there's so many different definitions of the word witch, there's so many different cultural associations, historic associations. Um, you know feminism, human rights, even looking to you know equivalent words for witch in other languages, and like what that means in the context of of that culture, that society. Um, you know, as we're all in like this global sort of soup of all of these different practitioners from all over the place talking about this one thing, but having all of you know witchcraft just comes with a lot of baggage, and everybody shows up with all of their own different bags and they're not the same bags.

Kim: 50:09

Um, so yeah, Now I have to think about that. That's fun. Is there anything else that you wanted to talk about that I didn't ask, or did you have any questions for me? Anything else you wanted to bring up?

Coby: 50:32

Um, I think we went really deep. We really covered, I think, a lot of the the really important stuff. Um, you know, I think anything else is just kind of the the superficial. We went really deep with this today. Um, you know, I am working on my, my next book, my next poison path book, um, which is going to be called The Poison Path Grimoire. Um, that'll be coming out from um Destiny Books in fall winter of this year. So super excited about that.

Coby: 51:11

Um, while the Poison Path Herbal kind of set out to just sort of in general define um, my little slice of the poison path pie, Um, the second book really delves into sort of more of my personal practice and ideas about um poison plant witchcraft and dark herbalism and really provides a lot of the more practical spell work side of things. Um, so I've got that coming and then also the? Um are we teaching a flying ointment class online January 20th? So I don't know if that'll air, um, that's next weekend by then, but I've got that coming up. Uh, people can sign up at the poisoners of pathocarycom. Um, it's live and recorded. It'll be about three hours long and then coming up. In March I will be hosting the botanica obscure a conference, which I'm super excited that that's still happening.

Kim: 52:18

Me too.

Coby: 52:18

Yeah, um, so I'm going to be doing that, co-hosting it with Amy Osvara, moon Of poison, plant witchery. Uh, we've got 26 different presenters on the lineup and it's just like a really, really well rounded collection of different plant based practitioners that are coming together this year. So super excited about that. Um, and then my next in person event that's not here in Florida is going to be in April at the Austin witch fest.

Kim: 52:57

I'm trying so hard to go there. I don't know if it's in the cards, but I saw you on the list. I was like no, I really want to go yeah it'd be awesome if you make it.

Kim: 53:10

Yeah, I would. I really hope I can. I was going to try and then, but I don't know if that's going to happen. So the last two things that I ask of my guests. Thing number one can you please recommend something? Anything doesn't have to be magical in any way. It can be a new sandwich you found at a restaurant you like. Please recommend something to the listeners.

Coby: 53:43

Okay, so we all like to burn incense. We all like the. You know incense cones, incense sticks that's great. You know charcoal discs. A lot of times those are just too big, too much smoke to be burning inside. So, like my newest, probably favorite thing from the past year or so has been these little incense ropes. Oh my gosh.

Kim: 54:13

I've been like holy shit, these are amazing.

Coby: 54:17

Yeah, I just love it. I love the way that they burn, the amount of smoke that they give off. You know, for a while I was just like lighting them and putting them in a little copper dish. But they actually have like these cute little. It's like a clay platform with a hole in it and then you just stick this little like crook shaped wire in it and then you hang them, which was like mind blowing that I think they were meant to be hung in the first place, but they're amazing and I think they're. They're from like Nepal or something like that is where they got started. But they're just like these little papers that are rolled up and twisted up and they've got plant material or incense in them. So I would recommend, if you haven't checked those out, those will be a game changer in your life.

Kim: 55:04

Seconded, and I'm going to tell you a secret. So I do monthly spell boxes and I'm making I'm making a little hanger thing and I don't know holder with the little hook. I'm making that to put in the boxes this month. Otherwise I wouldn't tell you because it's going to come out, I think, at the end of February. But yes, I'm very excited to make that and, yeah, highly highly agree, I love that stuff. I just bought a bunch of it because I was like this is way better than sticks.

Coby: 55:42

Yeah, you get a more natural smell. It doesn't have a lot of stick incense, it's just like blank stick incense that gets soaked in different synthetic fragrances that don't even smell like the things that are on the box, but with these it's the baby powder one.

Kim: 56:01

Why does that exist?

Coby: 56:02

I don't know why would you even?

Kim: 56:05

want to. That's very weird, but I bought like a combo pack on Amazon. Forgive me, but I bought a combo pack on Amazon and one of them was baby powder and I thought what in the hell is this? I don't know, it's real weird. I don't use it. I gave it away. The last thing is please tell me a story.

Coby: 56:34

So I recently, in October, I got a new pet, since I live pretty much by myself, unless I've got like, sometimes, my sisters here, sometimes I'll have like friends that have stayed and whatnot, but most of the time I'm by myself and I can't technically have a dog, even though I would like to. So I got a pet, a sugar glider, which is a really cute like little tiny flying squirrel type of a creature. So she's actually down here now in her apartment sleeping, because she is nocturnal, so she sleeps during the day. Her name is Eleanor. I named her after Eleanor Roosevelt.

Kim: 57:19

Good name.

Coby: 57:22

Yeah, she's a little cutie. So just kind of working on bonding with her and getting that connection. When I first got her I would like handle her and take her out and she's got really sharp little nails and so like scratch up your arms like crazy and stuff like that. But I was still kind of sticking to it and wanting to create that bond. But we've been on a little bit of a break in that regard, just because the last time I picked her up she started biting my arm and like literally like she would bite it to the point and be like lifting and pulling the skin. So it wasn't just like a quick little like nip.

Coby: 58:07

It was like she was like trying to keep pieces of my skin off of me. It's like, okay, you can't do that. It's somewhere that they bite sometimes and if you just don't react that they'll get bored and they will stop. So I'm having these little like needle teeth biting and pulling at my arm, like, okay, just don't react and she'll stop. Well, she definitely didn't. She kept going, kept biting.

Coby: 58:35

So I got her and put her back in her little house. So I've just been kind of hanging out with her in a more indirect way. So they have these little pouches that they stay in. They're called bonding pouches. Basically you can carry them around to travel and that's a way to help to get them to form a connection with you without just carrying them around in your hand, Because they're pretty fast and they're super curious, so they like to run all over the place. So she's got that. And then for the holidays I decided that I would hang a little it's like a little felt Christmas stocking in her cage for decoration. I did that. She pulled the glitter off of it, pulled off the glitter strip, and now she seems to like the Christmas stocking better than her actual pouch. So there's this little like just tattered looking felt stocking in her cage that she sleeps in every day.

Kim: 59:50

That sounds adorable.

Coby: 59:52

Yeah, she's super cute. So they're totally an adventure and just got these other things that are for them to play on when they're out and about and they're like these little upside down umbrellas that you stick to your wall and they've got like a little plastic chains that come down that they can climb up and they get on their little umbrella platform and can look around and stuff. Since they typically live in in trees, they like to be up on on higher places. So I got one of those and the best thing about it is that they will actually jump off of the platform and they'll fly to your hand, Like if you reach your hand out, and they're just super cute because they've got like their little furry webbed wings that they have. They stretch out when they jump from place to place, and so that's just really precious.

Kim: 1:00:49

I like looking at them.

Coby: 1:00:51

Yeah, they're super cute.

Kim: 1:00:54

But we have six cats so I think that would be a terrible choice for brought one home.

Coby: 1:01:02

Yeah, the cats would love it.

Kim: 1:01:04

They think it was great.

Coby: 1:01:07

Power, maybe until they caught it, yeah.

Kim: 1:01:12

Which they would because they have a catio and birds sometimes get in the catio and then they'll catch the bird and bring it into the house. We have let several birds out because the cats brought them in and they're not outside cats. It's a catio, it's in clothes. The cats can't go wander. I don't know why the birds want to come in there. Once there was a hilo monster and it bit my other cat on the hand. I mean it was her foot, but whatever I'm going to say, her hand.

Coby: 1:01:40

Yeah, you'll understand being out in Arizona with the scorpions. So we have an emperor or Empress. She's an Empress Scorpion that they're very scary looking. Yeah, they're very scary looking. But if you were to take away the sense of sight and just go off of, like their physical capabilities, I think that the sugar glider Eleanor is much more vicious than the scorpion. You know, if you get stung by the scorpion it's maybe just like a bee sting, which is no big deal. But you know, she's got little razor blade hands and razor blade teeth and a crazy streak that lasts for days. But she's cute.

Kim: 1:02:44

I don't handle arthropods because no, thank you. But I like looking at them. And my husband, he's held a scorpion before. We have a picture of him with one on his head because it was interesting. But yeah, I've never seen a scorpion grab hold of you, even with their claws. No, oh, rodents, thank you so much for being on the show. It was really fun to talk to you.

Coby: 1:03:17

Thank you, it was a pleasure being here.

Kim: 1:03:20

Everybody go follow Coby on Instagram and everywhere else. Make sure that you put an alert in your calendar for the book coming out in fall slash winter and I will see you, probably on the internet, on Instagram. Okay, bye! Coby. Welcome to Hive House. This is where we do the fun questions and I can move around, and it's okay for me to make sounds, because my group doesn't care. They know who I am Now.

Coby: 1:03:55

I am.

Kim: 1:03:57

Can you please tell me your favorite quote?

Coby: 1:04:01

What is food to one is bitter poison to another.

Kim: 1:04:12

That's a good one. That's her name in my head Jennifer something, is it? Jennifer? Anyway, stiffler's mom, yes, okay, so this is going to be a wild ride. What five things are you bringing with you?

Coby: 1:04:24

Well, I would bring my, my cell phone, my cigarettes, my cannabis, gummies, my dancing gloves. Oh yeah, I have dancing gloves. They are. They're just these long black gloves that I got from Spirit Halloween and they've got like two inch long claws on them and I find like really helpful and conducive for dancing and some people maybe even seen them out and about over the past couple of years. So I would bring those and maybe I'd bring some. I bring some glitter because, you know, always have a good time with glitter.

Kim: 1:05:16

Now I have to think about what adventure that's going... (fades out) T o hear more of the members only episode. Head over to crepuscular conjuration. com. The Monthly Magic tier will give you access to the monthly magic Marco Polo group, the private Facebook group and access to the written monthly spells. There's also Crepuscular Conjurations giving you bonus podcast episodes, coloring pages, guided meditations, spell crafting videos, printable downloads and more. The free Witchy Wonderment level will give you a little sample of everything I just mentioned.

Kim: 1:05:52

You can also visit my shop, clever Kim's Curios, to get spell boxes, one at a time or by monthly subscription, intentional handcrafted jewelry that I make especially for witches and handmade altar tools. You can even listen to the full Your Average Witch podcast library, including show notes. Check it out at crepuscular conjuration. com. Thanks for listening to this episode of Your Average Witch. You can find us all around the internet on Instagram at Your Average Witch podcast, Facebook. com/ groups/ hive house, at youraveragewitch. com, and at your favorite podcast service. If you'd like to recommend someone for the podcast, like to be on it yourself, or if you'd like to advertise on the podcast, send an email to your average witch podcast at gmail. com. Thanks for listening and I'll see you next Tuesday.